Good afternoon. I will call to
order this special public
meeting of the Clark County
Commission on Aging. It is
Monday, February. It's March
16th. And my name is Ellen
Rogers and I am the chair of
the Commission on Aging
meetings of the Clark County
Commission on Aging are held in
a hybrid meeting room. This
means that Commission members,
guests and members of the
public have the option to
attend in person or remotely,
or by watching it online as
well. For members of the public
attending remotely, other event
participants cannot see or hear
you unless they are
acknowledged by the commission
chair or staff, and your audio
is unmuted. I will be
announcing the agenda items as
we move through the meeting
topics. In case you do not have
the agenda in front of you, and
an opportunity for public
comment will be held at the
beginning of the agenda.
Following a few business items.
We will start with a roll call
of commission members who are
present for this meeting.
Commission members, please say
here after I call your name and
as a reminder to all of us,
please don't forget to mute
yourself when you are not
speaking. Mike Anderson here,
Julie Donovan here. Cass
Friedland here. Donna Mason
here. Kevin Masterson is not
here. David Moss here. Ellen
Rogers is here. So given that
we have more than five
commission members present, we
will have a quorum. So we are
allowed to take decisions as a
group or to vote on things.
Okay. We will now move on to
business items. The first item
is approval of today's meeting
agenda. I will take a motion
for approval of the agenda.
>> So moved.
>> Second, is there any
discussion on the motion to
approve today's meeting agenda?
Hearing none, I will request a
vote. All those in favor of
proceeding with the agenda for
today, please say I.
>> I, I.
>> Anyone opposed, please say
nay. Hearing none, then the
motion passes. Moving on to the
meeting notes. The meeting
notes have not been completed,
so we will push approval of the
February 18th meeting to April.
Do we need to vote on that?
Susan and Amy. Okay. The next
agenda item is a proposed
amendment of the bylaws. Due to
scheduling conflicts, the date
and time of future Commission
on Aging meetings needs to be
changed. Staff have prepared a
proposed bylaw amendment
outlining outlining that future
meetings will be held on the
third Monday of every month
from 315 to 6 p.m. Is there any
discussion of the proposed
bylaw changes? I am seeing no
discussion. I will take a
motion for approval of the
bylaw amendment.
>> So moved.
>> Seconded.
>> Is there any discussion on
the motion to approve the bylaw
change from the third Wednesday
to the third Monday of the
month of every month? Okay.
Hearing no discussion, I will
take a vote for all those in
favor of the bylaw change.
Please say I.
>> I, I, I.
>> Anyone opposed, please say
nay. Hearing none, the motion
is passed. Chair.
>> I apologize. We should have
added this to the agenda. We
need to do public comment to
see if there's any comments on
the bylaw changes. Oh.
>> So do I just open up public
comment?
>> So we have one person online
and we have a couple people in
the room. So why don't we start
by asking those in the room if
they'd like to do public have
make public comments, and then
I can read the intro and see if
anyone online wants to make any
comments.
>> Okay.
>> Is there anyone in the room
that would like to comment on
the bylaw changes?
>> Is the essence of it just
moving to Monday? The time is
the same.
>> The question was if it's the
same time on Mondays, and the
answer to that is yes. Okay. So
if you can bring this the
public comment up on the screen,
I will read the intro. If
you're using a computer, tablet
or smartphone, if you would
like to make a comment, please
raise your virtual hand. There
are instructions on the screen
on how to do this. Typically,
the hand icon is located
towards the bottom of the
screen. For anyone on the
telephone, please dial star
three on your phone's number
panel on how to raise your hand,
and staff will be able to see
hands once they are raised, and
will request to unmute you one
at a time. Just giving someone
more time to raise their hand,
but I do not see any raised
hands. Thank you.
>> So is the motion then passed
or do we need to revote? Okay,
okay, so now we will move on to
the next item on our agenda,
which is general public comment.
So we request that any comments
that are made are completed
within three minutes to
accommodate time for all
speakers. We will also request
that before you make your
comment, you state your name
for the record. Are there any
guests in the room that would
like to make a comment please?
Can you come here and make your
comment?
>> Looks like we got a green
light. Thank you, Madam Chair
and Commission members. First
off, I just want to say how
grateful I am for each of you
serving as you do, and I know a
few of you from some of my past
activities. Don and I worked
together in community
development back in the early
2000 with Interact and Identity,
Clark County and, and, and also
the, the, what was the name of
the Healthy Communities project
that Clark County Public Health
had been driving? So that
really fired up my juices
around community development.
And we, we launched a community
development nonprofit community
development corporation in the
mid 2000 s in support of the
fourth plan Cortes
revitalization effort. And, and
we were blessed to serve in
capacity around mobilizing
grassroots efforts to support
some of the initiatives around
the Sudbury plan that the city
had developed. That was the
second Sudbury plan that the
city developed, and they had
found that there were
significant resources available
in the community. So the
strengths really dictated that
even though the community went
or the economy went south, it
was really time to move forward
with what we could. And so we
helped with that process. And
our focus was in three arenas
one food security, housing
security and small business
development that aligned with
those efforts. I've had the
opportunity to serve on both
the Affordable Housing Task
Force for the City of Vancouver.
And and then we developed a
demonstration project around
housing renovation to create
affordable housing
opportunities and to move
forward with get the community
to move forward with the
community Land Trust model.
Part of that work helped to
bring proud ground to the
community, and we also helped
habitat for humanity in terms
of shifting its approach to a
one and done sort of
contribution to affordable
housing, to using the land
trust model so that those
investments would continue in
perpetuity. I served on the
county's Housing Options study
and Action plan as the city's
representative for
neighborhoods and affordable
housing, and grateful to see
the report you had in your 2024
annual report as to how you've
been moving some of those
initiatives forward. I've been
in the background watching as
the county's focused on the
implementation of those
policies, and we're standing
ready to move forward with a
couple of initiatives that we
think are going to facilitate
getting more affordable housing.
In particular, we are proposing
a an initiative that supports
existing fam families and
particularly people in
financial need on their single
family dwelling lots to get
into the housing affordability
density improvement agenda. And
in doing that, help these
people to be able to stay in
their homes as a part of that
initiative. So it's a fairly
complex move, but it's going to
be grounded primarily in what
the county's provided in terms
of access now within the urban
growth boundary and
particularly outside of the
municipalities right now. So
comprehensive plan right now is
going to play a key role in all
of that. So I came today in
particular to listen to the
presentation by our friends at
the Vancouver Housing Authority,
and they have continued to be a
great resource for us. And so a
big piece of our work is
focusing on elderly housing and
how to incentivize that,
particularly with the faith
community. We've got a couple
of faith bodies here in the
community, have done some
exceptional things around
development of their properties.
And we think that given the
significant discretion and
latitude the state provides to
religious institutions and
institutions, we see that
there's a very good opportunity
for, if not just the church
itself or the faith body itself
to serve its own members, but
also to be able to extend that
out into the broader community.
So thank you for your work. I
will just say I served as a
part of the housing committee
for the commission in 2016.
Chuck Freyer had put together a
team of about 5 or 6 of us to
help the commission in that
process. And I would just
direct your attention to the
summation of that. We held a
community wide forum for the
2016 initiative, and I believe
it's still on your website.
Some excellent information and
recommendations that here we
are ten years later, and we're
just starting to scratch the
surface of some of those. But
it's not surprising, given the
complexity of the situation we
have around housing, how that
system has been developed and
developed in a way that worked
because that's the way it was
set up, and now we're really
coming to a head with looking
at how do we reclaim some of
this middle housing that really
created this relief point for
folks to move forward, both
economically as well as to
ensure their ability to remain
in the community? So thank you
for your work, and I'm grateful
for it.
>> Thank you. Can you state
your name? I didn't get it in
the beginning.
>> Sorry. Mark Madura and I
live in the Rose village
neighborhood in the city of
Vancouver. Lived in that
neighborhood since 2005, and I
moved here in 1990 from Central
Oregon.
>> Thank you.
>> Oh, and I was going to share
my can I share some history on
ski patrol? I was a national
patroller, Mount Bachelor for
40 years. So appreciate your
service.
>> Thank you.
>> Yeah. If you're using a
computer, tablet or smartphone,
if you'd like to make a comment,
please raise your virtual hand.
And for anyone on the telephone,
please dial star three to raise
your hand. No raised hands.
>> Thank you. Commission
members, do you have any
clarifications or questions on
our public comment that we got
today? Okay, so this concludes
the general public comment.
Thank you very much, Mr. Mizula,
for coming. We next move to our
moderated discussion that will
focus on housing. We are joined
by a guest from Vancouver
Housing Authority. And Cass
Friedland is the moderator for
the session today. So I will
hand over the agenda to Cass.
>> Well, thank you so much.
Thank you so much, Ellen. So
good. I have evening, but I
guess afternoon, evening. And
thank you for joining us today
for the second of four panels
focused on the exceedingly
complex issue of housing for
aging adults in Clark County.
It's an honor to welcome our
panelists, Dani Ledesma, who is
dedicated to ensuring that
every senior in our community
has access to a safe, stable
and affordable place to call
home. In January, we invited
Samantha Whitley and Michael
Torres to talk about their work
and share their perspectives,
and we learned that we are in a
perfect housing storm. There's
an acute need for housing in
Clark County because we have a
deficit of housing units, and
our region is experiencing
unprecedented population growth.
We also heard about a variety
of housing initiatives that are
available to residents, but now
understand that funding those
programs that support aging
adults continues to face
budgetary challenges. We were
thankful to learn so much more
about the Houseless Crisis
Response system at the federal
and state levels, and because
of that conversation, we now
know that many of our aging
Clark County neighbors might
already be on the road to
homelessness, even though we
might not see it or experience
it in our daily lives. To
underscore comments from our
January panel, it is clear that
the need for senior housing in
our county is rapidly
accelerating. By 2035, nearly 1
in 5 people in Clark County
will be over the age of 65. The
safety net for aging adults is
very porous, as low income
seniors are now the fastest
growing segment of the newly
unhoused population in our
county. Many others are living
on the edge. One rent increase,
one medical bill, one financial
setback away from losing their
housing and waiting lists for
access Roeun months and often
years behind. With these
factors in mind, we are
absolutely delighted to welcome
Danny Ledesma, Chief Real
estate Officer of the Vancouver
Housing Authority and executive
director of Columbia nonprofit
Housing. Today, she will tell
us about great work that is
happening through a robust,
dynamic, city nonprofit
partnership. But first, let me
share details about Danny's
really interesting professional
life. Danny believes in the
power and potential of public
organizations to connect
resources, expertise, and
advocacy with the needs of
underserved communities to
create housing, health,
education and equity solutions.
She has served in executive
level roles in the public
sector as an Assistant County
Administrator at the Wasch in
Washington County, Oregon,
senior advisor for Racial
Equity and social Justice at
Portland Public Schools and the
equity policy and
communications director at the
Portland Housing Bureau.
Managing policy, rental
development and home ownership
programs. Danny worked in local
politics as a policy advisor to
Oregon governors. Kits is a
Kitzhaber or Haber haber. Thank
you. And Brown and a Portland
City commissioner, Nick fish.
She's also worked extensively
with culturally specific and
housing nonprofit organizations
as a consultant, and served as
an interim executive director
of the Coalition of Color
Communities of Color at VHA.
Danny is thrilled to work with
the talented members of Real
Estate department to increase
and improve the supply of
affordable homes to meet the
needs of our community. Danny,
the Commission on Aging truly
looks forward to your
presentation. We have provided
some questions to you, but
following the presentation, you
may find instead that Coash
members may enthusiastically
jump in with their own
questions. So we'll see how
that goes. At the end of our
question and answer session, we
will entertain questions from
our audience. And without
further ado, Danny, please.
Thank you.
>> Thank you so much. I'm
really honored to be here. And
I usually just tell everyone
that I'm a housing nerd. So
thank you for indulging and
reading my my bio there. I
thought that today what we
could do is sort of talk about
the question of, you know, can
we afford to age in place in
Clark County? Oh, yeah, you can
hear me. Sorry about that. Can
we afford to age in place in
Clark County? But I wanted to
do it from the perspective of
an owner operator, someone who
is really charged with building
and owning and operating
affordable housing. And so I
thought I could tell you a
little bit about the Vancouver
Housing Authority, a little bit
about CNP or Columbia nonprofit
housing, and then talk a little
bit about that perfect storm
that you've heard about, and
then go from that into a little
bit about the development
process. And we might make
developers, nonprofit,
affordable housing developers
out of you, you know, in 15
minutes. So we'll see. So I,
I've been at the housing
authority for a brief time, a
little bit over a year, and it
is really fabulous. Oh, should
I do the clicker or do okay.
Next slide. So in it's I'm so
honored to have worked with
Andy Silver, our CEO and the
team of people that we have.
It's so wonderful to be able to
walk into a community where
folks see the public sector and
certainly a housing authority
as like a true partner. And I
know that that's just been tons
and tons of work that the staff
does, and really wanting to
make sure that we're meeting
the needs that are there. As
you know, our mission is to
provide housing options for
people who are experiencing
housing barriers. And we do
that in three ways. We are the
county's. Basically
administrator of project based
section eight and tenant based
section eight. It's the only
rent assistance program that
the federal government funds.
And so as a housing authority,
we administer that program. We
also have an operations side of
our house that really owns and
operates all of our housing.
And then we have a real estate
team that is sort of charged
with developing more housing
and keeping in good repair. The
housing that we have in
Vancouver Housing Authority
portfolio, we own and operate
about 52 different properties.
That's close to 4000 units. And
we're we're unique from a lot
of other public housing
authorities and that we're very
active, some would even say
aggressive developer of housing,
because we really see both our,
you know, our, our leadership
and our, our board really see
that that need for that. What I
like to think of infrastructure
of housing that's affordable,
the market, unfortunately does
not provide for enough
affordable housing. And so that
public investment in this
infrastructure of housing, I
believe, is really important.
And we have some strategic
priorities. We passed a
strategic plan a little over
two years ago, and I'll talk a
little bit about the the one
that we're really charged with
on my team, which is expand
affordable housing. And we'll
talk a little bit about demand
and supply. So if you remember
economics or if you just we're
going to, we're going to talk a
little bit about about that and
sort of why we think the supply
side strategic notion is really
important, especially for our
community here. On the next
slide, I'll tell you a little
bit about Columbia nonprofit
housing. The Cncf, as we call
it, was established by the
Vancouver Housing Authority in
early 80s. So just after the
L.A. Olympics. So you can
imagine we're about coming on
to the next LA Olympics. So
it's been a while. And we. Cncf
owns and operates about 14
total properties. It used to be
13 and we just added a new one.
So we need to update our
website, which is about close
to 486 units will round up and
say 500, but 486 units, six of
the 14 serve populations with
special needs. But the majority
are really focused on housing
for older adults. And so I've
listed on the slide here the
different properties and the
number of units that are there.
And you can see that it is. And
maybe you've seen or driven by
and seen that these are a
really important, an important
part of our community's
portfolio, because these are
properties that have really
scarce and really dynamic
federal funding that supports
these. And as you'll hear later,
that federal funding is really
kind of at not even at risk.
It's really sort of like gone.
And so we'll have to think as a
community, how to be creative
and think about how we can,
since the, you know, since the
1980s over, you know, 40 years
really try to, you know, not
just do this amount of housing,
but, you know, we would have to
triple it to meet to meet the
need. So we've got to try to
think about as many, you know,
tricky and strategic actions to
take to be able to, to meet the
need. So I like to start with
what is affordable housing. And
I like to always ask people
when I talk about housing,
which I always do, is how many
people live in affordable
housing. And a lot of people
are like, what? I don't live in
affordable housing. Like, you
know, but the way that HUD,
which is the Department of
Housing and Urban Development,
conceives of affordability and
the way that the entire
affordable housing industry
thinks about housing is based
on this definition of what is
affordable. And according to
HUD, what is affordable is and
you live in affordable housing.
If you do not spend more than
30% of your gross income on
your housing, which includes
like utilities, you know,
parking, all of those, all of
your housing costs, anything
that is more than 30%, they
start to, to give different
categories. So you are
considered rent burdened if you
spend more than 30% of your
income on housing, okay, you're
considered extremely rent
burdened. If you spend more
than 50% of your income on
housing and they have a new
designation of housing need
called worst case needs. And
this is defined as folks who
have incomes that are below 50%
of the area median income. They
do not receive any form of
government assistance, and they
have over 50% of their income,
their, their that extremely
rent burdened and or they live
in substandard housing. And
what we know about the United
States is that there are 8.5
over 8.5 million households
that qualify as worst case
needs in our country in 2026.
So there is a lot of need in
Clark County. What we know is
that 74% of renters who live in
Clark County that have incomes
at the 30% of Ami are severely
rent burdened. And that makes
sense, right? Folks who have
lower incomes are going to face
a bigger rent burden. But we
also know that 27% of renters,
regardless of income, are
severely rent burdened. Nearly
a third of our community here
in Clark County and nearly two
thirds of our community at 57%
of renters, regardless of
income, are cost burden. So
they're spending more than that
30%. So for folks who have been
a long way away from a
statistics class, like I have,
you know, when we talk about
median, we're not talking about
the average. We're talking
about if there were 100 people
that lived in Clark County and
you lined up from folks with no
income to folks with the
highest income, you would look
at number 50 and you would say,
what's your income? And that's
the median income. That's kind
of, you know, when you think
about your home and, you know,
the cost that you put for home
and the things that you'd like
and how you'd like to age in
place, you know, a lot of
people don't start to think
about like area median income.
A lot of people think about
their budget. And when we talk
about affordable housing, we
want people to be able to
afford their housing and not
have to make a choice between
paying their light bill or
paying their grocery bill, or
paying their medical bill or
their prescription bill. Right.
And what we find is that in
Clark County and throughout the
country, that many people are
having to make this choice, and
for folks who are on a fixed
income or limited incomes, this
choice is excruciating. I've
got some more bad news, so
we'll keep on going. So the
according to US census data and
you, you brought up the the
statistics about how the
fastest growing folks who are
becoming houseless are folks
who are older. What we know is
that 13% of Clark County
residents have a disability
where independent living or
mobility is difficult for them.
And so that is going to be
really challenging when you're
looking for a home, right? So
you can't have like a walkup,
like a four story walk up to be
able to get to that home. And
we know that there's a
significant amount of Clark
County residents that have
those challenges. 7% of Clark
County residents live in
poverty. But we know for folks
who are over 65 years old, it's
nearly 10% that live in poverty.
So there is a disproportionate
in terms of and you already
know this, but when we talk
about Clark County and what's
affordable, 33% of the
population are renters. So a
third, right, the average
renter earns about $49,000 a
year, or about 23, a little
over $23 an hour. Right. So the
national the National Low
Income Housing Coalition puts
out a report every year called
Out of Reach, and they talk
about what is the state's
housing wage, what is the
country's housing wage? And
also what is our county's
housing wage. And so for Clark
County, which is part of the
MSA, that includes Washington
County, Multnomah County, and
Clackamas County in Oregon, the
housing wage that you need for
just an average two bedroom
apartment is closer to $38 an
hour. So you need to be making
$79,000 an hour to be able to
afford what the real housing
wage is. Or if you're making
$23 an hour, you would need
about 2.3 full time jobs to be
able to afford rent at that
wage. It's untenable. Right.
Okay. I think one more well,
two more, two more sad pages.
The next thing is just talking
about housing affordability,
right? So what we know about
our current inventory in the
city of Vancouver between 2011
and 20 2021, you know, rents
increased by 70%. That's huge.
Right? In a decade, wages did
not follow that same trajectory.
Wages not even increased by 20%.
They increased by a little over
18%, close to 19%. So what we
also know that in 2010, folks
who were receiving federal
disability payments, whether it
be Social Security folks who
are on fixed incomes, that the
folks who received the largest
of those federal disability
payments, 89% of that was
needed to pay for a rental unit.
This is in 2010, right? In 2023,
120% of that payment is needed.
Untenable. In Clark County, the
basically, there are 22,000
households that earn 50% of the
area median income, right. So
and there's only 11,000
affordable and available units.
So we have a pretty significant
inventory issue. And then what
we also know is that, you know,
that chart that I showed you
before that showed like, you
know, the rents that would be
affordable to folks at
different percentages at the
end of the day, you know,
$1,000 starts to be, you know,
a rent that gets affordable. If
you can get rent under $1,000,
you're doing great. In Clark
County, 10% of the occupied
rental units, that's 10% of
those have rents for less than
$1,000 a month. In the United
States, there's over a million,
a million unit shortage and the
fastest growing number of units
that become unaffordable is are
units that are at rented at
$1,000 or less a month. It's
just not out there in our
inventory. We also know that in
Vancouver that there are market
units you can't really see in
the screen, but those are I
can't tell the colors, but
they're on the screen. It was
like kind of blue, green. And
the market units, there are way
more market units than there
are affordable units, which
creates unmet need. And what we
know is that every year in, in,
in Vancouver, that in addition
to the regular production, we
need a thousand of those units
to be affordable for folks who
are at 80% of the median income
and below. But recent data and
a recent study, if you haven't
read it, I would encourage you
to read it. I'm such a nerd.
But the Georgetown put out this
report called abundance for Who,
and we've long been saying,
especially for affordable
housing developers have been
saying is that, you know, in
addition to needing rent
assistance, in addition to
needing services for folks who
have housing needs, we just
need more supply and we need to
be able to find out ways to
build it more efficiently, more
responsive to the physical
needs, and done more cost
effectively. And so we are just
getting out of a housing boom,
where in the past five years
after, after, after the Covid
epidemic, we went into a
housing boom. And in in
Washington, the Seattle area
was one of the top five areas
in the country that had the
most housing production. And
what this report says is that
in those five areas where there
were the most housing
production, the growth of
unaffordability of
Unaffordability was did not go
down because most of that
housing boom, most of what
we're producing are housing
that that rents for more than
$1,000 a month. And for way
more than the average person
can afford. Certainly the
average renter or certain or
someone who's on a fixed income.
So what do we do? Right? So we
also know that we're in really,
unfortunately, we're in really
uncertain times from a policy
perspective. At the federal
level, there is a lot of
uncertainty and certainly
policies that are challenging
the way that we typically do
housing. We are in an
environment where the cost to
own and operate housing is more
expensive than ever before,
right? So the cost to finance,
we've heard about interest
rates, right? Every affordable
housing I'm going to show you
in a minute, needs some amount
of debt and equity. Right. And
so the cost of debt is going up.
And that means either fewer
units or less affordability,
right. The cost of construction
materials and labor is
skyrocketing. You've heard
about in the past year about
the threat of tariffs, the cost
of still the cost of timber.
All of these have an impact on
the real estate industry. But
it's not just the cost of
materials and the cost to get
it built, the cost to operate
housing, you know, is going up
as well. In addition to labor
insurance costs, for example,
have gone up by over 40% in one
year. But then in our our
market here in Clark County,
vacancy is, is increasing.
Typically, you're in a, a
market where most folks
experience like vacancy between
like 4 to 5%, 5% typically is
what we model out when we're
doing our budgeting and we're
closer to 7%. There are some
markets and some neighborhoods
in unincorporated Vancouver
where the vacancy rate is
closer to 13%. And we also know
that rents now, speaking from
the the perspective of an owner
operator, rents typically
increase so much every year,
just like your cost of
insurance, your cost of
materials, your cost of like
fertilizer and trees and all
the things that make a
affordable housing property run
and rents are stagnating, right?
So that means it's great for
tenants, right? Except that you
can't get a project built or
you can't get a bank
underwriter to be able to give
you funding for the project
unless they see rents that can
support the debt. And if rents
are flat, then you can't
support debt. So I'm telling
you all this because at the
Vancouver Housing Authority,
we're like, great, we're going
to create some production goals.
And despite all of this, all of
this bad news that I'm telling
you, because the need is so
great, because our community is
in so much need, we decided to
create production goals where
we said, we're still going to
try to create 400 new units of
housing a year. We still have
goals around, you know who we
want to serve. And certainly we
want to make sure that we're
serving folks with the with the
greatest need. So how do we do
that from a development
perspective? So really quickly
go to the next slide. These are
the stages of development. How
many of you have heard from
concept to commitment? Have you
heard that? So basically you
come up with a concept. You go
through some feasibility, you
get funding commitments, you
close. It's when you sign all
the papers, you go into
construction and then you lease
it up and you close out. Right?
Simple. The development usually
takes anywhere from, you know,
2 to 3 years. We just closed on
our battleground portfolio
where we were doing new housing,
and we're also renovating two
of our other projects. And that
project was six years in the
making. So and as you can
imagine, that that costs a
little bit of money, right?
That adds to the cost of it. So
really quickly in feasibility
on the next slide, you know, we
think of things, we start to
think of things like, you know,
what, what do we want in terms
of this, this project, you know,
what's the concept? And two big
issues in, in coming up with
the concept are on the next
slide, location, location,
location, location, right. And
I know that transit is very
important to folks and thinking
about like, how do folks who
may not drive who rely on
public transportation or who
want to walk or bike or any of
those things, that's really
important. And so location
becomes more and more of a
driving factor about where to,
where to build housing. And
unfortunately, you know, some
of the best locations are also
the most expensive places to
purchase property. So in a
couple earlier, earlier slides,
there was like a chart where we
talked where you saw some where
we were looking at like, well,
in some places we have greater
need for folks who are older or
folks with disabilities. We
might have more children who
are on free and reduced lunch.
And so we're trying to sort of
rank where is need with also
the concept of like, how do we
get folks to live in properties
that are close to other
properties so that we can have
some economies of scale for
operating them? How do we also
sort of like meet people where
they are, you know, and so
location becomes something that
is a really big factor in
developing housing. On the next
slide. Oh, this is the sorry,
this is the, the sort of like
we worked with the Cascadia
housing to develop a housing
guide, and we tried to look at
housing need and some of the
issues around location are, you
know, have to do with like
gentrification and displacement
also where there's high
opportunity, like what are the
places that are next to a
grocery store? And so based on
that, we also had these dots
where we were looking at
density of v h, v h a owned
properties. And so we wanted to
sort of see like, how can we
cluster? And you'll see that a
lot of our properties are in
that sort of like
pre-gentrification area or
bordering folks, places that
are actively gentrifying. And
you'll see that unfortunately,
there's not that many of our
housing in high opportunity
areas. And so that, you know,
when you think about that from
a policy perspective, what does
that mean in terms of for folks
who might have lower incomes,
who are living in those high
opportunity areas, what is
their housing choice and how do
folks age in place if they are,
you know, living in those areas?
So we, we try to think about
all of those issues when we
were developing housing and
we're thinking of that concept.
The other thing that we think
about is need. And you know,
the the next slide is about
amenities. Oh, no feasibility.
No. It's amenities. Nope. Sorry.
It's about feasibility. So so
we have to make this work.
Right. So a lot of times what
happens is that we dream up the
most beautiful. Like look at
this. It's a beautiful building.
Do you see the trees? Do you
see those stick figures that
look like they're, you know,
it's like an intergenerational
family. You've got people with
different abilities on there,
right? And then the cost to
build it becomes more than the
cost that we have to be able to
get it done. So then we start
to, to value engineer, which is
a very technical term of sort
of like cutting out the wants
and needs. So on the next slide,
we start looking at the program.
And so this is the most recent
sort of like income and rent
limits. So a lot of times we
start to think about like, okay,
where's the greatest need? And
so if we think about it, it's
like for folks who are earning
less than 30% of the area
median income. So if we were to
look at a two person household,
that would mean that folks
would qualify. They'd have to
be earning $29,000 a year or
less. Right. But the rents that
would be charged for someone
who's making 29%, 20, 20, 9000
or less would be to for it to
be affordable, less than that
30% would be around $698 a
month for one bedroom, or a
little over 800 for a two
bedroom. And so that's where
leasing, when we talk about
leasing up and like dealing
with vacancy, a lot of times
you have to find that perfect
tenant who has enough income to
be able to pay rents at 600 and
$700 a month, but not too much
income so that they're not over
that 30% set aside. And so a
lot of times when you hear
folks talk about like
affordable housing, affordable
to whom we're using that sort
of that sort of metric. And,
you know, that doesn't
necessarily often. I think that
explains a lot of why we have
some high vacancies, even in
affordable housing. If you look
at, you know, a three bedroom
should be rented close to
$1,000. And we think that
someone who makes 30% of the
area median income would be
able to afford that, right,
starts to get tough. So when
you look at those two things,
but if we're going to serve
designated populations or
specific populations, we also
want to make sure that we're
providing adequate services. So
then we start thinking about
the combination between like,
what does it cost to pay for
staff to be able to enough
staff to be able to adequately
provide services in addition to
property management? We start
thinking about like issues like
accessibility. How can we lean
into universal design and how
do we not make sure that we're
not value engineering out those
critical things? So developing
that program becomes a lot of
throwing, throwing stuff on the
wall to see what sticks. But
also doing a lot of, you know,
what's really a need and what's
really a want. And how do you,
how do you sort of match that
with the need that's that's
there? So then we start to talk
about amenities, which I think
is the next one. Sorry. And
that's where we're trying to
find the balance between wants
and what the budget will allow.
And it's it's hard to think
about, especially when we think
about older adults and the need
for social, you know, social
interaction and creating
community. One of the first
things that a cold hearted
developer like myself will say
is, oh, let's not go too big on
the community room because
that's un rentable space, right?
Like I'm not getting any
funding for that. That's not
paying the rent. And so you can
start to see those community
rooms start to shrink and the
value engineering process,
right? The community gardens,
like, you know, when we go out
to especially our properties,
our senior properties, you see
so many amazing stories and
experiences where you have
older adults working with like
the local grade school, you
know, learning not just, you
know, gardening, but like all
the things, all of the social
capital that you get when you
have that intergenerational mix.
And oftentimes, you know, the
gardens, it starts to become
like, if I can get more, more
envelope, I can get more square
footage in the building, you
know, like lesser impacts, less
room for the gardens. Then you
start to see, you start to see
what that looks like. And then,
you know, pools and weight
rooms and dog parks. It all
becomes part of balancing that,
especially when you're thinking
about like feasibility. Another
big part of feasibility on the
next slide is talking about the
budget. So for folks who, you
know, potentially bought a
house, I like to tell folks
that, you know, anyone can be a
developer and, well, you know,
well, there's lots of folks who
like, you know, get really
fancy with Excel. If you
basically think about when you
buy a house, affordable housing
development is pretty similar
to that, right? You're starting
to think about like, how much
equity can you bring? Like
what's your down payment? And
in affordable housing, the
largest program in the country
for providing equity is the low
income housing tax credit
program. And so recently, as
part of the, the president's
big, beautiful bill, while
there were a lot of painful
cuts to services, one of the
things that they did in that is
that they increased the amount
of low income housing, low
income housing tax credits that
are available for each state to
allocate. And also some of the
requirements to have other
types of funding, like a match
program. They they lowered that.
So tax credit equity has
resulted in, you know,
thousands, tens of thousands of
units of affordable housing
throughout the country. It's a
great program, but it is a
little bit it's a little bit of
a dance, right? So we're
basically trading in tax
credits for investments. And
there are middlemen, if you can
imagine that sort of help to
match developers with these
investors. And there's lots of
rules and lots of lawyers. And
a tax credit property is more
expensive to build because you
need all that additional
expertise to be able to do that.
And then to operate that, that
building, you need a lot of
expertise as well, because
you've got to do a compliance.
You got to make sure that
people's income is is up to
date. And so you can see that's
a great program. But it also,
you know, adds to some of the
costs of affordable housing.
But right now, that's one of
the best ways that we can get
equity into a project. The
state Housing Finance Agency
administers the program. It's
pretty, pretty great. But then
you also need some amount of
loans, right. And there's
different ways that the housing
authority has access to
financing. But basically we're
trying to, in a budget, make
sure that the cost to construct
it and the future costs of
operating it can be paid for
with a loan and that the rents
can cover payments of that loan.
Right? So it's very similar to,
to buying a house. So if anyone
says that you can't be
affordable housing developer,
you let them know it's very
simple. So on the next page, I
have to tell you about another
challenge. So between 2021 and
2024, when you're, when you're
developing housing, you want
your budgets to balance, right?
So the sources we used to get
pricing for tax credit equity
between 90 to $0.95, right?
Great. That means for every
dollar of tax credit, we would
get $0.95 up to $0.95 back to
put into the project for equity.
Right. We also are very
fortunate in both the county
and in the city in that we have
elected officials who are not
just committed to developing
affordable housing and
affordable housing in word, but
in action. We've got lots of
resources here in Clark County
to be able to do that, but
local subsidy really covers
that gap between the equity
that we have and some of the
interest rates. So if you want
to be able to have lower rents,
you'll sometimes have a bigger
gap. And places like
foundations or the City of
Vancouver's affordable housing
fund can usually fill that gap.
So it matches. Oh no, look what
happened. So as land, as
construction, labor, soft costs,
insurance, as all of those
things increased, something
else happened. Equity prices
started to go down. So instead
of having $0.90 on every dollar,
now we have, if we're lucky,
$0.85 are so right. So that's
$0.15 per dollar not gone. And
interest rates are so high that
you really can't cover that
spread. So your gap becomes
bigger, right? And so that
local subsidy or whatever else
becomes really important. And
so I think a lot of times
people are like, oh, why can't
the math, math, you know, why
does rent have to be so high?
Like, why are things so
expensive? And it's because
this is the real estate market.
This is the reality of the real
estate market here. So we're
really trying at the housing
authority to think about how
can we be creative to bring
down the uses, right? So we're
trying to think of ways to
build more efficiently or more
cost effectively using, you
know, different materials that
might be more cost effective,
getting better and more
efficient as a team. And then
we're also trying to think
about, are there ways that we
can work with the city to think
about different ways to obtain
debt? Are there ways that we
can work with different types
of investors to help with the
local subsidy, and so on and so
forth. So that really becomes
the tough nut to crack,
especially when you think about,
you know, you wouldn't want to
compromise all those things
around the uses, you wouldn't
want to compromise on, on
something like design if it
meant like we were having
universal design, right? A
place where you can age in
space, you wouldn't want to
compromise on some of the
materials that, you know, could
be more durable or could be
slip resistant, or, you know,
any of those things that help
contribute to what could make a
home not only safe, but also
meeting the needs of, of older
adults. So, so we're really
trying to sort of figure out
how can we, how can we grow the
sources and at the same time
not think about how to control
costs as well. And so it
becomes a little bit of a dance.
So if you get through that,
that, that piece, and that's
really one of the tougher
pieces, then we go into funding
commitments, right? So we start
to apply for all of these funds.
And the, the section 202
program, which is a large
program that for a while has,
has been responsible for most
of the senior housing that's
subsidized in the country. And
so a lot of those projects that
you saw in the Cncf portfolio
were funded with section 202,
and we have a project that's in
our pipeline in Washougal
that's planned for Washougal,
and it'll serve older adults.
Washougal is a high opportunity
area. We know that there's a
population, an aging population,
and it's great to have some
housing opportunity there. And
so we were so excited. We've
been working with the city of
Washougal. We're very excited
and we applied and we didn't
get funding and we were like,
oh no, what happened? And so we
went through our debrief and
they were like, well, you were
close. There was so much need.
We can't fund everyone. That's
fine. So we're like, when is
the next nofa? And they said,
oh, not for a while. And we
were like, oh no, what, what?
And they're like, we're
probably not for at least the
next four years, this, this
program, this funding isn't
available. So, so that critical
leg of the stool is now sort of
like gone. And so, you know, I
think when we think about, you
know, advocacy, I think a lot
of times we focus on that, that
local layer because they're so
responsive to us, right? And
our local electeds are doing so
much to respond. But there is,
you know, an infrastructure at
the federal level as well, and
that is being slowly eroded.
And, you know, it's complicated.
And, you know, the federal
budget is, you know, it's nuts,
right? But this is one where,
you know, I think that because
not that many people get into
the weeds of like, what are
these development tools,
especially for older adults,
that this kind of has just gone
a little bit unnoticed. So, so
funding commitments are very
important. We have at the state,
we have a lot of resources. The
state legislature just put more
funding into affordable housing.
On the capital budget side, we
just came out of their their
annual funding round where they
provide gap financing, and they
were oversubscribed by so much.
We had a conversation with them.
One of our projects got funded,
another one didn't. And so when
we talk to them about our
project, they're like, oh,
you're in such good shape.
You're part of this like tier
one of folks that are going to
be prioritized. And next year,
you know, you'll be in that
tier one. We're like, great,
awesome. And then on a whim, we
said, how many people are in
that tier one? And they were
like, oh, 90. So you know, they
weren't kidding. You know, they
are really oversubscribed. They
talked about going from having
like 50 applications to like
250 applications across the
state. So it's, it's, you know,
it's a reflection of the
affordability crisis. And I
think, you know, living in
Washington and living and being
a community member in
Washington, there are so many
folks who are really trying to
address the problem. But it
can't be Washington. It can't
be Clark County alone. We
really need a larger effort to
make sure that there's adequate
resources there. So let's say
you get all your funding
commitments, you go through
closing, the lawyers are making
sure that everything gets
recorded, that we're following
all the rules, the investors
are making sure that we've got
enough, you know, skin in the
game. And they're like making
sure that we'll pay them back,
you close, and then you start
construction. And construction
is fun and there's a science to
managing construction. But I
won't talk to you about that.
And then the last, the last is
close up and lease up. A lot of
times the way that you're able
to get your tax credit equity,
they pay it in installments.
And those installments are are
predicated on an agreement that
you say will be leased up by
this amount of time. So when
you start to think about like
that big risk that we take in
sort of thinking that if we set
rents affordable for folks who
are earning 50% of the army and
below, and we're going to
charge this rent, then leasing
becomes that exercise of trying
to find those perfect tenants
that can qualify to be able to
to be able to live there, but
also have enough of that income
to be able to pay rents that at
50% MFI in the larger units
start to get over $1,000. So
the good news is you all can be
affordable housing developers
now you you know it. And it is
I think that it is a really
challenging time right now. But
I know that there's a lot a
strong community of affordable
housing developers, a strong
community of folks who are
really trying to think about
how we prioritize and how we
get this done. But any time you
go to a grand opening or a
ribbon cutting or a
groundbreaking, you'll notice
that there's tons and tons of
partners. And that's because we
really are trying to braid
together and cobble together as
many partners as possible to
make this work. Because, you
know, and even even our friends
who are who are developing
market rate housing, it's
becoming more and more
difficult. And so we really
need that sort of like network
of friends and partners to be
able to make it happen. I went
way over 15 minutes. Thank you.
So much.
>> Thank you. Thank you for
sharing, sharing wonderful
information. Now let me ask the
group. Let me ask maybe, chair,
should we jump in with
questions or should we ask
these questions? What do you
think? Do we have why don't we
take some questions first from
the commission and we'll see
how that all pans out. And then
we'll we can always grab up
these questions afterwards.
Who'd like to ask some
questions of Danny.
>> This is excuse me. I've got
a cold. This is Mike. One of my
questions has to do. I know a
large cost of development is
the property. Okay. But I also
realize that Vancouver has
height restrictions on
buildings where, you know, if
you go to the East Coast or
other places in larger cities,
height restrictions are much
higher. And I've wondered if
that has been addressed. I
think right now it's at like
four storeys.
>> Well, so the city of
Vancouver is adopting their
updated codes and comp plan,
and I understand that it'll
interact with the counties as
well. And so they've really
they've been great in sort of
thinking about. So it's the
there's a couple of things that
sort of impact. So once you
have a lot, let's say you've
got a lot of property for, you
know, a dime, right? Then what
starts to impact the ability to
get it done is height, right?
And also parking and the cost
to build both. So right now
there are height restrictions,
but they're building code
requires a different level of
building type. Once you go
above a certain amount of
height. And so what I can tell
you right now is that given the
cost of still, given the cost
of anything, we're probably not
going to be in the business of
building like those towers that
get you more density anytime
soon. It's just so cost
prohibitive to be able to do
those. So what we're, what
we're focusing on and what the
new building codes are allowing
for is more of the sort of like
garden style or four storeys or
below. And in doing that, so
we're, we're really, if I were
to prioritize, you know, some
of the hindrances to getting
projects built, the height
requirement just because of the
cost is something that we, you
know, we just typically can't
get to. I've heard rumors about
like, you know, mass timber and,
you know, but that I think is
still in early stages. And so
that might be able to compete
with the cost of still in terms
of performance and cost, but I
don't know that we're exactly
there yet. I haven't seen
numbers that show that, you
know, that savings that would
make the height going high good.
I think the other thing that's
really challenging is that
elevators, although not very
expensive to install, are
incredibly expensive to
maintain. There's like maybe
for elevator repair companies.
And so it's just, it's really,
it's really tough. We're
spending quite a bit money of
money on an elevator
modernization project where we
have properties where the
elevators or one elevator, you
know, needs a repair and it's,
they're really expensive. So
we're trying to figure out like,
is there something in the
design of our buildings where
we can think about maybe a part
of the building is like a
subgrade so that you don't have
to climb three flights of
stairs, you can get to the
entrance and then only have A12
up and one down. But we in
general, we're trying,
especially for older adults, we
don't we wouldn't build a
building higher than three
stories without an elevator,
and even then we would probably
stay between four, you know,
around four stories. And all of
the code allows for that.
>> Okay. Thank you.
>> Sorry I complained about
elevators. I always do that.
>> So you talked about a 7%
vacancy rate in Clark County.
Did I hear that correctly?
Where is that if it's not is is
it in like higher or higher
expense?
>> It's so it's, it's the
average of the, of Clark County
is the 7%. So if you, if you
looked at all of the for rent
properties, regardless of rent,
it would be 7% in. We've heard
in some markets. And so we use
a platform called CoStar and
they pulls like, you know,
property information. When we
pulled property information for
some submarkets, we were
starting to see 13% vacancy
rates in like Hazel Dell. So
it's really, it's really
intense.
>> So doesn't that mean that
there's less of a problem with
supply?
>> Well, I think the issue is
that the we're seeing more
vacancy at the higher at the
higher up. You know, if you
look at you know what it is.
But it also is, I think,
indicative of the fact that
folks don't have the same like
eviction prevention tools that
we had during, during the
pandemic. A lot of that sort of
like emergency housing or
eviction prevention funding has,
has, you know, sort of expired.
And then I think it's also
indicative of the fact that we
haven't been able to issue new
tenant based section eight
vouchers. And there there
really isn't a, a, you know, a
rent assistance that's
sustainable for folks who are
there. So we're seeing a lot of
folks move or unfortunately,
who are unable to pay rent. And
in our portfolio, we've seen,
we've had a lot of issues with
folks that have moved in,
haven't been able to pay rent
or they're, you know, maybe
some of their support has gone
away and then they, they move.
And so we see a lot lower, sort
of shorter tenure times.
>> This is Ellen again. Is that
also related to the fact that
we have so much more supply now
with all of these larger
complexes coming in in Clark
County, I mean, they're all
starting to come online. And so
because I anecdotally know
people who are small landlords
and I know that they have empty
units as well.
>> Yeah, I think there's a
little bit I was talking to
someone and they were like,
there is no filter. You know,
that sort of like as people
move, they sort of filter into
like the different affordable
units, the, you know, the
experts declared the housing
boom over in 2026. And we are
seeing in Clark County quite a
bit of that sort of, you know,
the product from the boom go
unrented. But a lot of what was
built during the boom was, you
know, properties that were at
the, you know, who could serve
higher than 80% we're seeing
and where vacancy is really
acute. And I don't have the
exact numbers, but we, we do
see higher vacancy for those
units that are targeted for
rents that are affordable to
folks at 120% of the median
family income. So I think that
we are seeing more units, but
those units are, are really
sort of targeted and have
always been targeted for higher
incomes. And that Georgetown
study, you know, kind of
basically reinforced that. They
said we had this great housing
boom. The US, you know, did
great in sort of being able to
supply and build. But we were
pretty agnostic when it came to
prioritizing at what levels and
what need. And there there
probably weren't enough
incentives to build for folks
who are, you know, either zero
or, you know, 0 to 30% of the
area median income.
>> One last question, though,
are there programs to help
people get into people at lower
incomes, get into some of these
units that are at higher income
to help them cover that spread
in rent. Those those section
202 funds that are gone.
>> Yeah. So the section 202,
you know, provided like a
subsidy, but the subsidy went
to the unit so you could rent
the unit at whatever the tenant
could afford. And then the
subsidy paid, paid, you know,
the rent that it costs to build.
And so we don't have as a
community, we, the housing
authority isn't able to issue
new, new, new vouchers, either
project based or tenant based
and probably won't for, for a
while now. So it's, it's really
tough. A lot of times when you
hear like that the federal
budget or the HUD budget stays
flat with that actually is, is
a cut because rents increase,
you know, labor increases. And
so that means that we couldn't,
certainly couldn't add new
families to the, to the program.
But also, you know, we don't
want to try to do that. So the,
so the biggest program is this
section, section eight program.
But that is, you know, harder.
I think after the pandemic, we
had more programs like eviction
prevention or rent assistance.
And so there are, there are
some, the folks go through the
Council for the homeless. We
have like a centralized like
intake system where folks can
find those resources. There are
through our counties services
around aging. We have we work
really closely with a lot of
state and local programs. We
just. The Laurel Manor that we
just opened, the 82 units that
was does have. It is a
subsidized project. And so we
worked really closely with our
partners to be able to, to
match folks. And we were able
to at least up really quickly.
But it was because they had
those resources.
>> Are there any other members
on the commission? I would like
to ask questions of Danny.
>> This is Darina. I guess, you
know, there's a vacancy rate
that you've talked about, but
like, you know, I've been
working with a granddaughter to
help her get her first
apartment on her own. And like
so many of the new units that
are being constructed, like the
big complex, just off mill
plain and. Well before 136,
it's big, but they're starting.
Rents are like $1,700 a month,
coupled with for studio studios,
small studio Parkings extra,
and that's just for flat lot
parking. And of course, our
community is moving, but it's
still pretty auto dependent,
coupled with one of the things
I found and from a few months
ago when I talked about the
Humane Society and doing
everything we can to help pets,
companion animals, stay with
senior citizens, the rent that
is now charged for pets.
There's one complex at 136.
They charge $500 a month for a
pet, coupled with the deposit.
So if you had two pets and you
report those pets, that adds
$1,000.
>> Oh yeah.
>> Month, year rent. So what
most people do is smuggle them
in. But which is tricky if you
got a big dog. But anyway,
point is, you know, seniors
want those and they're not
going to they would rather live
in a tent with their pet than
have they can't afford, you
know, the average rent, I think
per pet plus the deposit is
about 30 to $40 a month. You
had your rent plus everything
else. So it's an incredible I
mean, I really appreciate
everything you presented, but
it's just incredibly complex
problem. How specifically do
you relate to the VHA? Are you
a totally separate organization
from the housing authority, or
are you part of it?
>> So the Cncf is a totally
different entity, and that has
its separate board of directors
that are sort of like charged
with the governance of MPH, but
b h a basically supports BI
staffing. So I but I, I'm an
employee of the VHA and I'm
also an editor there. So part
of my salary is, is supported
through Sieanna.
>> It's a great program. Really
respect what you're doing.
>> Thank you. You know, the a
lot of times when we talk about
like what's affordable and, you
know, that sort of calculation
of the 30%, you know, you
shouldn't spend more than 30%
of your gross income on housing
and your rent payment or your
mortgage payment and associated
costs. One of the things that
we hear a lot, especially from
like our resident advisory
board, is that, you know, when
we calculate like utility
allowances, when we're trying
to figure out like what's
affordable, we hear a lot about
like, but all of it's not just
your, you know, your, your
trash and electricity and heat.
It's also required renter's
insurance required pet
insurance required, pet fee,
parking fee. And so we've
really tried with some of the
policy flexibility we have as a
moving to work agency to make
sure that like when we are
calculating income or
calculating rent, that we're
taking all of the must pay fees
and we're counting that as a,
as affordable. Sometimes when
we are, you know, working with
other partners, we see that
some folks are like, oh, like
that doesn't count as rent. And
we're kind of like, well,
realistically, if you're
requiring a tenant to pay that,
that's it's, you know, it's a
required fee, it should be
considered as a housing cost
because yeah, we, you know, we,
the, the, the need for animals
and pet companions, it's, it's
very important. So yeah.
>> Thank you so much, Danny. I
mean, I feel like we have had
the benefit of a college level
course in no, but in, in a
great way because we hear
numbers all the time. I mean,
they're published in the paper,
but you gave us the threads and
the context and the meaning
under that, which is priceless.
So thank you so much for
educating us and for sharing
with us. But I do think that we
might have perhaps others in
our audience, either online or
here, that might want to ask a
question. Can I pass it over to
you, Susan?
>> Yes. Why don't we start in
the room? Is there any one in
the room that would like to ask
a question?
>> Mark Madura I live in
Vancouver, Washington. Not
really a question. I just want
to compliment you and Vancouver
Housing Authority for doing
everything you can with the
existing structure we have. And
I think you laid out a very
clear picture as to how the
existing structure and systems
are not going to get us out of
this problem. In my mind,
Vancouver Housing Authority
needs to go back to square one,
and the war housing production
effort and look at some
innovative approaches that take
those components that make up
the financing package and turn
them on their head. Single
family zoning is the
predominant land base, and
that's where most of the
problem resides in terms of
people's ability to be able to
live on those properties. So
part of the solution has to
involve how do we incentivize
increasing density on single
family properties? And when you
start to add up all of the
revenue and equity that's
available there, all we really
need is some systems in place
that allow us to create
financing tools that address
the needs on a local scale and
stop depending upon these
higher level systems that are
so subject to the whims of
whomever, and really come
together as a community and say,
this is what we need to do, and
this is going to be how we do
it. The city has established a
new community development
financing institution in fourth
plane. A number of bankers in
this community came together
and took the existing community
Development Financial Institute
and woven into Rivermark. So we
have a huge philanthropic
community. So it's simply a
matter of how do we create a
structure that allows us to
start to capture that existing
value in single properties and
weave it into a strategy where
we can support people who do
not have the means to do the
development. But we can set
some structures up in a trust,
sort of a model, continue to do
things like the affordable
housing fund that the city has.
And, and it's a huge asset for
every dollar they collect. It
generates about 8 to $9 worth
of return on value because of
the access it gives to other
capital. So we've got to really
rethink this thing and start
investing in how we're going to
make that happen. The other
piece of it is the systems that
are in play will not facilitate
the scope of development and
construction we need to do so.
That has to be grounded back on
new business development, and
we should be designing some
initiatives that allow new
people that want to get into
the construction industry away,
to build their capacity to do
so. And I'm excited that fourth
plane is going to take on that
with this new grant that
they've used with some of the
Arpa money. So in my mind, you
folks, the institutional
players are doing the best job
you can do probably better than
anybody else in the country
when you look at where things
are at. But new tools have to
be generated and somebody has
to step up and say, how do we
make that happen?
>> Well, I totally agree. I
think that and we're trying to
be as innovative as possible. I
think we just released an RFP
where we were seeking out
development partners for a
project. We were sort of like,
how can we reduce the cost per
door? And so we're in the
negotiation process, but we're
trying to think about like how
to, you know, use some of the
technology that goes behind
modular development, but think
about modularity in not
necessarily an implementation,
but the use, the efficiency and
the design and the planning for
the project. And so hopefully,
you know, we continue to move
forward on something like that.
And we're, if all goes well, we
could, you know, significantly
reduce the cost per unit. We
were looking at modeling like
anywhere close to like $100,000
per unit of savings. So I think
it's really a credit to not
just, you know, Virsha, but the
partners and the development
community, the, the local
foundations here are really
amazing. The Community
Foundation for Southwest
Washington has a swift loan
fund. We which, you know, it's,
it's great because they're
providing that sort of like
short term capital that you
might need at the beginning of
a project. And so just knowing
that that's there and they've
really grown that we've got a
couple of philanthropic leaders
on our board of commissioners.
And, you know, they're, they're
constantly going to other parts
of the country to sort of seek
and learn. And certainly the
mayor, you know, kind of ran on
the code changes to try to
think about like how you
incentivize like density and,
you know, as like a planner
nerd too. I was like, you know,
when did politics ever, you
know, when did anyone think
that? Like, you know, planning
decisions could hold like the
attention of like the political
climate of the day. And it
seems like really brave and
courageous and, you know, kind
of aligned with everything. So
I think we do have a really
great community. And you can
see from all sectors, people
really trying to, to, you know,
kind of crack the nut there.
>> Okay. For our online guests,
if you would like to make a
comment, please raise or ask a
question, please raise your
virtual hand. And there are
instructions on how to do this
on the screen. And for anyone
on the telephone, please dial
star three on your phone's
number panel. I do not see any
raised hands.
>> Okay, so I'd like to say
thank you to Danny. Your
presentation was great and I
loved. We had a presentation
about a year ago on housing,
and you were echoing some of
the things that we learned
about then. So we are almost
ready to become public housing
developers. Last week we or
last month, we learned to
become transportation planners.
So we are all, you know, honing
our portfolios. Anyway, I just
wanted to say thank you very
much. Thank you, Cass, for
orchestrating this. This was
excellent. And if there are no
other. Are there any other
comments? We're going to close
out the fireside chat. Thank
you, thank you.
>> Thank you.
>> Okay, so that wraps up our
agenda. From now on, our
meetings will be moving to the
third Monday of each month. Our
next regular meeting will take
place on Monday, April 20th at
4:30 p.m. where we will be
discussing mobility challenges
with no other agenda items to
discuss. This meeting is
adjourned. Thank you